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leglock_mike's picture
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i was wondering what you people think about it. i found a school around where i am at. i wanted other people opinion about the fighting style.

bcwcmw's picture
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spetsnaz are super scary bad dudes, but i dont know about that dvd clip..... i have a tough time with energy and pressure points fighting... i have a feeling spetsnaz recive more of a sambo/krav/bas rutten bouncer dvd style style hand to hand training.... if you attack a spetsnaz you would be playing for keeps, not some goofy drunken fall on the ground thing... but what do i know.

"To know, yet to think that one does not know is the best... Not to know, yet to think one knows will put one in difficulty."- LAO TZU

Killbot's picture
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I have never seen anything legit from any Systema stuff I've come across. Seriously, the last 30 seconds of that vid should be enough to tell you what to expect. Jedi mind tricks, over-compliant training and such.

Disregard Systema - Acquire Sambo.

(ROSS is the only thing close to not crazy I've seen come out of Russia beside all the Sambos. ANd it even has some batshit insane stuff in it.)


"Don't let up until you hear cartilage snap, or they crap in their pants."
"Kickin' me was right. Checkin' to see if I was okay was wrong.."
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MrBungle's picture
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Anytime I hear anything about unbalancing chakras/chi/etc red flags go up. I'm not really familiar with systema but from that vid it doesn't look to promising. Find a good BJJ/Sambo/catch wrestling school, you'll be better off.

11th dan in Parnes Jiu-Jitsu, it's one more than Ransom's. Real PJJ goes to 11!

bruceleeroy's picture
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Also I'd like to point out that I don't think the Russian Military (spetznas) are really training this mind control part of systema.

SpaceChomp's picture
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I've seen some videos of Systema things that would/should work (i.e. punching how you swing a hammer similar in some ways to hapkido), and even some of this video doesn't look horrible if you only watch the first two minutes with the sound off. The wrist locks/throws looked kind of like aikido to me.

But I would have to agree with the above posters that a lot of martial arts tailored around pressure points and energy flow just aren't successful in real world applications. Is this a video from the place you are looking to train? You might consider sitting in on a class to see if you feel like it's a joke. I try not to judge anything outright unless I experience it in person.

However, unless I was in Russia, I don't know if I would even think about training in systema.

tat2edup's picture
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bcwcmw- I agree with you brudda. Spetznas are some serious bad dudes so I dont see them training in a style that mimics "Dim Mak" or whatever the hell that was. It only worked in STAR WARS.

A mixture of SAMBO and KRAV MAGA is more likely to be on the training regimen of Spetznas soldiers.

If you are looking for some sort of military self defense to get into I would suggest Krav Maga.

-Adam Mays "Courage is endurance for one moment more" "If size mattered, the elephant would be the king of the jungle." FREESTYLE AMERICAN SHOOT TEAM Thanks to eagles for the sig!

krazylarry's picture
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Where is Smabo steve? He has some insight into systema.

Been beaten and scarred, you'll never break me. I'm born again hard.

bruceleeroy's picture
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TAT? Dim Mak also worked in bloodsport. but, as we all know "bricks no hit back".

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tat2edup's picture
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@bruceleeroy- HAHA, I agree and I was referring to that video which revealed that the "death touch" doesnt work, unless of course you are a student at that dojo. You know, the one that Stephen Bonner was in, on that news show. Where the guy claimed that if you dont believe, or your tongue is in the wrong position or your big toe is off the floor then it doesnt work.

There are so many live videos in which martial arts, claiming to be effective without contact, are disproven. Like where that stupid old dude but up 5 grand in a challenge match to any MMA fighter that could beat him. Of course he was thrashed. This happend right after it showed him taking his students down without touching them.

-Adam Mays "Courage is endurance for one moment more" "If size mattered, the elephant would be the king of the jungle." FREESTYLE AMERICAN SHOOT TEAM Thanks to eagles for the sig!

Reilly Bodycomb's picture
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i think star fleet hand 2 hand combat training is the best way to go:

bruceleeroy's picture
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Hey tat - I knew where you were going with it, just couldn't resist throwing out a Chong Li reference.

Who do you think would win in a street fight???? Reilly Bodycomb or Captain Kirk.

ketkrokur's picture
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I studied systema for a while under Vladimir Vasiliev in Toronto. I also have close friends who have gone to Russia to train with Mikhail Ryabko. The stuff they do, though it may not look it on video, is legit. The paradigm, however, is completely different from what you are used to in a sport grappling context. When you throw guns, knives, multiple opponents into the mix the nature of the game changes. Engaging fully with a single opponent can lead to a knife in the back or worse. As long as you realize that, and don't try to compare the two in unrealistic ways you can have a lot of fun with systema.

I found systema training has a lot in common with the way we train in BJJ and submission grappling. Most of the class is spent slow-speed sparring, basically taking the speed and intensity down a notch so you can practice in a safe, yet realistic, manner. You spend a lot of time having people come at you with knives, sticks, punches, et cetera. You slowly condition yourself to get used to being attacked like this, and develop methods for countering their advances.

The strikes in systema are excellent, and definitely worth learning on their own. They have a really subtle way of developing a lot of power from unconventional movements. Anderson Silva's striking is probably the closest corollary in the MMA world. Their strikes seem almost too relaxed to have any power, but they are devastating. You spend a lot of time punching each other with varying levels of intensity and without gloves. You get a really good feel for how and where to strike effectively, and how to effectively take a punch. This is probably the least pleasant aspect of the training, but it is very rewarding. The time I've spent training systema has really helped me appreciate Silva's unorthodox striking style, especially his famous KO against Griffin.

The takedowns they use are a bit difficult to get unless you realize the difference in paradigm. In a ring it is advantageous to engage and control your opponent. In a lethal force environment engaging someone completely is very disadvantageous. Even if you are controlling one opponent you have immobilized yourself and left yourself open to attacks from others. In systema you spend a lot of time working with multiple opponents, learning how to use them off of each other and how to control the situation while maintaining your ability to move.

Systema isn't for everyone, if you don't have some sort of background in grappling or fighting it will be difficult to slow-speed spar effectively. You can fall into the Aikido trap, where people practically throw themselves when the instructor touches them. You have to be able to keep it real while not injuring your training partners. I would consider it more high-level stuff for people who already understand how to fight, and have an appreciation for the subtlety required in lethal force environments.

That being said, I don't know anything about the guy featured in the video. I would suggest checking it out. If the instructor is legit you'll know relatively quickly.

leglock_mike's picture
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thanks for the info guys. i am gonna go to a class here in a few weeks. i found out their is several different systema. The Most effective one i have seen is the one from Mikhail and Vladimir Vasiliev those are two guys that seem to make it work. One of the teachers i am going has train with both of them for 10 years and active in the police force. The first lesson i will learn is defending myself in a car cause when the weather is nice they told me they set up a real life situation and show you how to defend i'm excitied and can't wait to mix this up with my sambo.

tat2edup's picture
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@bruce- Does Kirk have his laser pistol? That would change the game. However, if Reilly was sporting his hawk, no-gi rashguard and venom shorts Id have to bet on him.

Chong Li references never get old BTW.

-Adam Mays "Courage is endurance for one moment more" "If size mattered, the elephant would be the king of the jungle." FREESTYLE AMERICAN SHOOT TEAM Thanks to eagles for the sig!

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